Game Thread **Official Iowa vs. Wisconsin Game Thread - 11:00am on ESPN**

[ivan_drago]

The best part of Iowa being ranked is now "See! ISU is good! They sort of almost beat two ranked teams!"

And then when they get absolutely stoned by the next five opponents, they'll say "Iowa isn't that good. Iowa State would win 10 with that schedule!!"

 

[Lime]

In the case of IA vs. WI, that was clearly going to be a very low scoring game given the nature of the two teams, wind conditions, etc..

It wasn't that clear though. Iowa was on their second drive. After going 6 plays and 28 yards (not great but not terrible), they had gone 9 plays and 43 yards. Wisconsin had gone 12/56 for their first one. Not exactly B12 scoring, but both teams had been moving the ball in line with the 27-20ish score that was roughly projected (I think that's what Massey had, and what I find is Wisconsin -7 with an O/U of 45). The wind maybe drives that down a bit but it was hardly a lock for a 10-6 game at that point.

even then, if the defenses are that dominant, keeping control of field position isn't a bad thing. Kicking the FG gives you 3 points, but it also sacrifices ~15 yards of field position, moving UW from inside the 10 to the 25 after the inevitable touchback.

 

[FranklinHawk]

I would divorce my wife if I ever found an ISU game on my DVR.

I have an ISU game on my DVR, of course it's Iowa kicking their assess a few weeks ago.

 

[Talkin' Goat]

I was fine with Kirk going for it on 4th there. What pissed me off was the playcall on 3rd down. A slow developing running play with Daniels as the RB and Wisconsin selling out to stop the run. I know the coaches were thinking they had two downs to get a first, but that call had no chance.

 

[newsbreaker]

The factors are built into the stats.

That is a great macro level chart, which ignores individual game and team circumstances.

For example, if a team is down by 2 with 3 seconds to play and it's 4th and 1 from the opponent's 10 I'm sure that we can all agree that you ignore the chart and kick the FG. Thus, we can agree that the chart is not a reference to be followed in all circumstances.

In the case of IA vs. WI, that was clearly going to be a very low scoring game given the nature of the two teams, wind conditions, etc.. I'd argue that a FG in a low scoring game is arguably more important than it would be in a high scoring game.

You also have to take into account your team's attributes. Canzeri is not a great short yardage back, and Daniels is ineffective right now (either due to injury or because he just isn't that good). That made a run on 4th and 2 a suboptimal play, which the coaching staff saw as well as they went to the pass.

I'd argue that going for it on 4th and 2 if you had Shonn Greene on your team makes more sense than if Jordan Canzeri is your RB. Of course that's not on the chart, is it?

In that late game situation, you wouldn't consult that chart. You'd consult the chart for the particular game scenario, which would almost certainly instruct you to kick the FG.

 

[MikeyJoe]

Can people please stop saying that the "stats" ignore time and game situation? JFC.

 

[douglasbader]

The factors are built into the stats.

That is a great macro level chart, which ignores individual game and team circumstances.

For example, if a team is down by 2 with 3 seconds to play and it's 4th and 1 from the opponent's 10 I'm sure that we can all agree that you ignore the chart and kick the FG. Thus, we can agree that the chart is not a reference to be followed in all circumstances.

In the case of IA vs. WI, that was clearly going to be a very low scoring game given the nature of the two teams, wind conditions, etc.. I'd argue that a FG in a low scoring game is arguably more important than it would be in a high scoring game.

You also have to take into account your team's attributes. Canzeri is not a great short yardage back, and Daniels is ineffective right now (either due to injury or because he just isn't that good). That made a run on 4th and 2 a suboptimal play, which the coaching staff saw as well as they went to the pass.

I'd argue that going for it on 4th and 2 if you had Shonn Greene on your team makes more sense than if Jordan Canzeri is your RB. Of course that's not on the chart, is it?

This was already discussed above, and you are still wrong with all of the caveat shit you threw in.

Here, let's do another favorite method of mine and have much smarter people than me like @MikeyJoe @Lime @CamelTones @Whatever @HiawathaHawk and various others explain to you how you are wrong on this one, especially if you are trying to compare it to the fake FG against Iowa State.

 

[Debit One]

you are still wrong with all of the caveat shit you threw in.

The "caveat shit" such as pointing out that you would ignore the chart in certain game circumstances is simply to point out that your chart is not sacrosanct.

you are wrong on this one, especially if you are trying to compare it to the fake FG against Iowa State.

a) I am not comparing the two. The ISU fake FG was a level of coaching stupidity that is beyond comprehension. I mentioned that as evidence that Kirk has a simple mind on such matters "the On/Off switch metaphor," which is set to "On" for this season.

b) The "you are wrong on this one" continues to be opinion rather than fact-based, but that's fine. You're entitled to your opinion, as I am to mine.

 

[douglasbader]

you are still wrong with all of the caveat shit you threw in.

The "caveat shit" such as pointing out that you would ignore the chart in certain game circumstances is simply to point out that your chart is not sacrosanct.

you are wrong on this one, especially if you are trying to compare it to the fake FG against Iowa State.

a) I am not comparing the two. The ISU fake FG was a level of coaching stupidity that is beyond comprehension. I mentioned that as evidence that Kirk has a simple mind on such matters "the On/Off switch metaphor," which is set to "On" for this season.

b) The "you are wrong on this one" continues to be opinion rather than fact-based, but that's fine. You're entitled to your opinion, as I am to mine.

No to your first thing as that was already addressed above.

You sure did lump in your point a) with that same dumb play. The point b) isn't an opinion, you are actually wrong on this. I'm sorry mommy and daddy told you there were no wrong answers and every opinion counts, but you are simply wrong. Don't blame me, blame the really easy math and countless studies done in this case.

 

[Harlan]

Loog why didnt you invite Glen to your place like a real hawkeye?

Stfu tavern Hok

What makes u think glen would want to hang with a nerdy OCD actuary when the Hawks r on

Hey Hawks r 5-0 u got ur tickets at Kinnick for this Saturday? Lol of course not

Monsta will b at Kinnick with all the other real Hawk fans, looker will be on the couch whining about the fans in Kinnick along with all the other pathetic tavern Hoks

I'm fully enjoying this plot twist.

 

[Bob Sanders]

The factors are built into the stats.

That is a great macro level chart, which ignores individual game and team circumstances.

For example, if a team is down by 2 with 3 seconds to play and it's 4th and 1 from the opponent's 10 I'm sure that we can all agree that you ignore the chart and kick the FG. Thus, we can agree that the chart is not a reference to be followed in all circumstances.

In the case of IA vs. WI, that was clearly going to be a very low scoring game given the nature of the two teams, wind conditions, etc.. I'd argue that a FG in a low scoring game is arguably more important than it would be in a high scoring game.

You also have to take into account your team's attributes. Canzeri is not a great short yardage back, and Daniels is ineffective right now (either due to injury or because he just isn't that good). That made a run on 4th and 2 a suboptimal play, which the coaching staff saw as well as they went to the pass.

I'd argue that going for it on 4th and 2 if you had Shonn Greene on your team makes more sense than if Jordan Canzeri is your RB. Of course that's not on the chart, is it?

4th and 2 isn't short yardage, it isn't even a run down. Its a pass/QB draw down almost all the time in cfb.

 

[Hawk_Kegmasters]

 

[Mo T]

Do "the charts" vary from NFL to college?

 

[douglasbader]

Do "the charts" vary from NFL to college?

Google it and find out.

 

[nolookpass]

Loog why didnt you invite Glen to your place like a real hawkeye?

Stfu tavern Hok

What makes u think glen would want to hang with a nerdy OCD actuary when the Hawks r on

Hey Hawks r 5-0 u got ur tickets at Kinnick for this Saturday? Lol of course not

Monsta will b at Kinnick with all the other real Hawk fans, looker will be on the couch whining about the fans in Kinnick along with all the other pathetic tavern Hoks

I'm fully enjoying this plot twist.

Unlike Loog and Ivan, my family members who go to college attend/attended Iowa

 

[BuffettHawk]

GFYIAP, Desmond King was named Big Ten Co-Defensive Player of the Week.

 

[Harlan]

Stfu tavern Hok

What makes u think glen would want to hang with a nerdy OCD actuary when the Hawks r on

Hey Hawks r 5-0 u got ur tickets at Kinnick for this Saturday? Lol of course not

Monsta will b at Kinnick with all the other real Hawk fans, looker will be on the couch whining about the fans in Kinnick along with all the other pathetic tavern Hoks

I'm fully enjoying this plot twist.

Unlike Loog and Ivan, my family members who go to college attend/attended Iowa

How very Amesey of you.

 

[sergeanthulka]

GFYIAP, Desmond King was named Big Ten Co-Defensive Player of the Week.

Good thing you qualified it, you had one coming...

 

[C.A.jones]

NewKirk doesn't do charts and graphs.

 

[BuffettHawk]

GFYIAP, Desmond King was named Big Ten Co-Defensive Player of the Week.

Good thing you qualified it, you had one coming...

I got lost in the debate about whether this was an emotional victory and didn't see it.

 

[BuffettHawk]

GFY, Silver Spoon.

 

[Hawk_Kegmasters]

GFYIAP, Desmond King was named Big Ten Co-Defensive Player of the Week.

Good thing you qualified it, you had one coming...

I got lost in the debate about whether this was an emotional victory and didn't see it.

To be fair, I just had a post pretty much word for word what you had there then switched it to the big pic from Hawkeye sports later.

 

[Herky823]

Not that this matters at all, but CBS Sports has their 2017 draft grades up and he's the 23rd ranked CB in their mind. This was updated last week. As I said, doesn't mean anything as they're likely just throwing shit against the wall right now, but odd that they have Mabin 4 spots higher than King, regardless of where they rank them overall. @L. Wade Childress must have consulted on the rankings.

 

[nolookpass]

King will play safety in the nfl

 

[ivan_drago]

Stfu tavern Hok

What makes u think glen would want to hang with a nerdy OCD actuary when the Hawks r on

Hey Hawks r 5-0 u got ur tickets at Kinnick for this Saturday? Lol of course not

Monsta will b at Kinnick with all the other real Hawk fans, looker will be on the couch whining about the fans in Kinnick along with all the other pathetic tavern Hoks

I'm fully enjoying this plot twist.

Unlike Loog and Ivan, my family members who go to college attend/attended Iowa

Don't go down this road.

 

[nolookpass]

I'm fully enjoying this plot twist.

Unlike Loog and Ivan, my family members who go to college attend/attended Iowa

Don't go down this road.

I think you should talk to your running buddy, Loog

 

[douglasbader]

Everything ok today nolookpass? You seem pretty angry.

 

[nolookpass]

Everything ok today nolookpass? You seem pretty angry.

Busting chops doesn't indicate anger.

 

[douglasbader]

Everything ok today nolookpass? You seem pretty angry.

Busting chops doesn't indicate anger.

This is a bit different even for you. Hope everything is ok.

 

[WCFHawkeye]

I would divorce my wife if I ever found an ISU game on my DVR.

If you are like many Iowa State fans I know Iowa State winning makes for a good day.

Iowa losing makes for a great day, no matter what Iowa State does.

Of course they are going to watch Iowa live and record the Iowa State game.

 

[TH1974]

GFYIAP, Desmond King was named Big Ten Co-Defensive Player of the Week.

FYI, IWAP

 

[BuffettHawk]

GFYIAP, Desmond King was named Big Ten Co-Defensive Player of the Week.

FYI, IWAP

IK, R?

 

[MikeyJoe]

King will play safety in the nfl

Denied.

 

[PipeDaddy]

Exactly. Kirk is doing it now, religiously, and people are still bitching. I swear it's probably the same people who just focus on results.

Kirk is overreacting to the criticism from prior years. The fake FG against ISU on the last play of the half was an example. It's as thought he has one giant On/Off switch, and right now it is set to On. He's going to do ridiculous stuff all year.

This is what scares me. I don't mind aggressive, and in fact he's needed to be more so... no more punting on the opponent's 30 yard line dammit. But he really is a dumbfuck when it comes to game time decisions like this. The fake field goal is the perfect example. Nobody with half a football brain would have let that unfold that way.

Regarding the call against Wisconsin - I was happy either way to be honest. Taking the points against a stout defense in a tough day to pass is fine. Going for it where the worst case scenario is they get the ball on their own 2 yard line is fine too. I wouldn't[ call it a no-brainer, but people get off on hyperbole so whatevs.

 

[YugoslavianMountainHound]

I liked the 4th from the 26. I didn't like the 4th and 2 call. I like the more aggressive KF, but had Wisky scored on the one instead of fumbling, the same iowa fans cheering the 4th and 2 call would be bitching iowa didn't take the FG.

And fuck off with your 27 yard FG isn't a sure thing. Yes, MK missed one. It will likely be the only one he misses from less than 30 yds all year. Low scoring game, FG is smart there. Definitely not a no brainer go for it situation.

How big would it have been if you went for it and made it and got a touchdown? You can fuck off with your FG is a sure thing in that wind. That's retarded.

Especially when KOHEN FUCKING MISSED A 27 YARD FG THE NEXT FUCKING POSSESSION.

@Heavens we need a photoshop of Koehn in a Kippah and with Payot.

 

[nolookpass]

King will play safety in the nfl

Denied.

you think he will play corner? I dunno if hes got the top end speed for that

 

[pjhawk]

Since it didn't cost us the game, I'm starting to really like the fake FG against ISU, smart coaching staffs like Michigan St (even though we probably won't play them) have to be wondering whether KF is legitimately thinking statistical percentages in-game now or if this is just the same scatter-shot dumb-fuck off-the-wall game management of the KF era.

KF chose correctly against Wisky, but was that by carefully thought through preparation or the on/off switch or what the heck ever?

 

[HawkLax6]

Got to get through this week's game, but next week's game is guaranteed to be on ABC/ESPN/ESPN2:

 

[AZmessDAWG]

Kirk is overreacting to the criticism from prior years. The fake FG against ISU on the last play of the half was an example. It's as thought he has one giant On/Off switch, and right now it is set to On. He's going to do ridiculous stuff all year.

I can get wanting to kick a FG there by a lot of fans, but if you are going to group that in with the fake FG against Iowa State, then you put yourself on the idiot list because they are literally the exact opposite of each other. One was the right call given all factors and the other was perhaps the dumbest play in college football history.

Someone said it after the ISU game that Kirk seems to be smugly saying "fine, you asked for it."

And regardless of how ill-conceived, or poorly timed these things are.....he's going to throw it back in our face with a see, I fucking told you so."

I love this characterization of what's happening now. Lol

 

[DGHawk]

It looks like Scheel is either hurt or not even close to cracking the rotation if he isn't traveling with the team.

I've heard numerous rumors over the past few months that his heart just isn't in it.

He is not hurt - a family member told me that directly yesterday. I have found it odd over the past few months that I have seen him frequently in his home town. I guess this plays in to your "heart not in it" rumors.

I really wonder how much of his athleticism he has back. This kid was simply one of the most phenomenal athletes I have ever seen as a sophomore and junior in high school. As a senior he looked like an average high school athlete, but he was basically on one leg. I have to wonder if he just doesn't have what he had and that is impacting his attitude because he is not the type of kid to just give up or not try.

 

[AZmessDAWG]

I didn't mind them going for it there, I like the confidence. I wouldn't have been upset taking the points though and even said as much before the play.

Any reasonable person thinks this.

 

[BLSardo]

I don't blame loog, nlp. Inviting a strange dude to your house off the internet is risky.

I will say, loog, opiate, Watson and edgeworth should catch a game at the Bryan Tavern. Outdoor covered patio with several TVs, about 40 hawk fans there. HKS music played in game situations (Back in black, enter sandman, IHTINB). Drink specials. Great thin crust pizza. Kids and dogs welcome.

You are welcome in most any room in my house, Glen.

 

[Aloha Mr. Hand]

SIAP.

 

[Lime]

SIAP.

that barely makes up for the scores of @Cykotherapy's friends that have been MURDERED in cold blood for wearing Iowa State gear.

 

[Aloha Mr. Hand]

If the Clones were in the I am a giant douche West, their teenage fans would be punched in the face too!!!!1

 

[The Full Monte]

I can get wanting to kick a FG there by a lot of fans, but if you are going to group that in with the fake FG against Iowa State, then you put yourself on the idiot list because they are literally the exact opposite of each other. One was the right call given all factors and the other was perhaps the dumbest play in college football history.

Someone said it after the ISU game that Kirk seems to be smugly saying "fine, you asked for it."

And regardless of how ill-conceived, or poorly timed these things are.....he's going to throw it back in our face with a see, I fucking told you so."

I love this characterization of what's happening now. Lol

It wasn't even my post dipshit. I was describing what someone else posted.

You need to calm the fuck down

 

[Glen]

I don't blame loog, nlp. Inviting a strange dude to your house off the internet is risky.

I will say, loog, opiate, Watson and edgeworth should catch a game at the Bryan Tavern. Outdoor covered patio with several TVs, about 40 hawk fans there. HKS music played in game situations (Back in black, enter sandman, IHTINB). Drink specials. Great thin crust pizza. Kids and dogs welcome.

You are welcome in most any room in my house, Glen.

 

[BLSardo]

You need to calm the fuck down

Calm the fuck down, douglas!

 

[Jimmie Dimmick]

SIAP.

Not suprising that 15 yo Iowa fan can take a punch from a Badger fan with only minor bruising.

 

[DGHawk]

SIAP.

The suspect is a white male, 20-25, with a red shirt. That should narrow it down to just a few people.